Hey there Kumada! I have another suggested "fix" for the Cthonversion Kit, in the "DRs, Percents, and NPCs" section...the values of these difficulties should be identical (they're not identical right now). As currently written:
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Standard difficulty on all rolls is DR 12. If a roll would be at “half skill,” it’s DR 15. At “quarter skill,” it’s DR 18.
and...
NPCs’ don’t roll skills against PCs. PCs roll against them with penalty instead. 50% NPC skill, +1 DR. 80%, +2 DR.
++++++++
As written above, the player-character would need to roll a DR 15 against a task at half skill, but only roll a DR 13 against an NPC imposing a roll at half skill value.
So...depending on whether or not the task is in opposition to an NPC, the player-character is rolling either a DR 15 (no NPC opponent) or a DR 13 (against NPC opponent) for their "half skill" attempt. That is murky and inelegant. Here's a suggested edit!
Suggested edit:
"Standard difficulty on all rolls is DR 12. If a roll would be at "half skill" (or against an NPC with 50% or greater skill), it's DR 15. At "one-fifth skill" (or against an NPC with 90% or greater skill), it's DR 18."
This edit streamlines things and brings the numbers fully in line with full/half/one-fifth difficulty ratings.
Ah! I haven't read the most recent edition, but now that I'm glancing through it it looks like they streamlined a lot, especially re: opposed rolls, which might make it hard to write the kit in a way that works with both old and new material.
I think in earlier editions you could end up in a situation where you had half skill and you're making an opposed roll, which is why I wrote things the way I did---but just now I went back and re-read some of my copy of 6th ed and I understand it even less than before.
I do like your idea of scaling flat DR off of opponent skill, but I think it might result in a lot of high DRs with the way CoC tends to give its NPCs skills.
I'll rework the section. The new version should be up in a minute.
You would probably be fine with an even shorter statement that covers the bases:
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"Standard difficulty on all tests is DR 12. If a test would be at “half skill” it’s DR 15. At “fifth skill” it’s DR 18. If a PC is opposed by an NPC, only the PC rolls. NPCs with skill levels imposing half and fifth skill rolls on PCs use DR 15 and DR 18, respectively."
I'll take another look at it, but I don't want to calibrate it too specifically for CoC 7th. That'll likely be a common use case, but I tested it on older CoC material, and it's broadly written to be for any d100.
Hello! Quick question on converting d100 NPC/monster percentage values: how does this work in play?
For example, if I have a night watchman with 65% Spot Hidden, this becomes 13 in Cthork Borg (1 DR per 5% skill rating). Subtracting 13 from 20 is DR7. So the night watchman has a Spot Hidden DR7...IF the night watchman NPC is the one doing the rolling.
However...
Since in Cthork Borg, the player-characters are typically doing the dice rolling most of the time, DR7 seems awfully low for them to elude the night watchman with Spot Hidden 65%. By the same logic, a night watchman with Spot Hidden 75% would have a DR5, and be even easier for the player-characters to elude, if we're subtracting the watchman's value from 20.
In other words, why subtract from 20? Why not just take the NPC or monster's percentage value and divide it by 5 to get the Cthork Borg DR value?
If the NPC or monster is making the roll, then yes, subtracting from 20 makes sense.
Ah, okay. This might be a design problem with no perfect solution.
In Cthork, with player vs NPC rolls, you typically just have the player roll against standard difficulty (DR 12). You can also apply penalties or bonuses based on weather conditions, the skill of the opposition, etc.
Those 'subtract from 20' values are for if an NPC needs to use a skill on their own. For example, Spot Hidden on a dingy room, or Climb up a cliffside.
That said, calculating 1 DR for every 5% of the NPC's skill definitely also works, and your method gives a lot more nuance to opposed rolls. I think GMs could use either.
Basically, in your above example, the Night Watchman's Spot Hidden DR 7 isn't the difficulty for players to sneak past him. It's the difficulty for him to spot non-player things in his environment. If he does try to spot a player, the roll for the player to sneak past him is DR 12 + optional modifiers assigned by the GM.
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Hey there Kumada! I have another suggested "fix" for the Cthonversion Kit, in the "DRs, Percents, and NPCs" section...the values of these difficulties should be identical (they're not identical right now). As currently written:
++++++++
Standard difficulty on all rolls is DR 12. If a roll would be at “half skill,” it’s DR 15. At “quarter skill,” it’s DR 18.
and...
NPCs’ don’t roll skills against PCs. PCs roll against them with penalty instead. 50% NPC skill, +1 DR. 80%, +2 DR.
++++++++
As written above, the player-character would need to roll a DR 15 against a task at half skill, but only roll a DR 13 against an NPC imposing a roll at half skill value.
So...depending on whether or not the task is in opposition to an NPC, the player-character is rolling either a DR 15 (no NPC opponent) or a DR 13 (against NPC opponent) for their "half skill" attempt. That is murky and inelegant. Here's a suggested edit!
Suggested edit:
"Standard difficulty on all rolls is DR 12. If a roll would be at "half skill" (or against an NPC with 50% or greater skill), it's DR 15. At "one-fifth skill" (or against an NPC with 90% or greater skill), it's DR 18."
This edit streamlines things and brings the numbers fully in line with full/half/one-fifth difficulty ratings.
What do you think?
Cheers!
Ah! I haven't read the most recent edition, but now that I'm glancing through it it looks like they streamlined a lot, especially re: opposed rolls, which might make it hard to write the kit in a way that works with both old and new material.
I think in earlier editions you could end up in a situation where you had half skill and you're making an opposed roll, which is why I wrote things the way I did---but just now I went back and re-read some of my copy of 6th ed and I understand it even less than before.
I do like your idea of scaling flat DR off of opponent skill, but I think it might result in a lot of high DRs with the way CoC tends to give its NPCs skills.
I'll rework the section. The new version should be up in a minute.
Okay, new version is up and should be slightly cleaner and more functional across d100 systems both old and new.
Hi Kumada,
You would probably be fine with an even shorter statement that covers the bases:
++++++++
"Standard difficulty on all tests is DR 12. If a test would be at “half skill” it’s DR 15. At “fifth skill” it’s DR 18. If a PC is opposed by an NPC, only the PC rolls. NPCs with skill levels imposing half and fifth skill rolls on PCs use DR 15 and DR 18, respectively."
++++++++
Cheers,
Brian C.
I'll take another look at it, but I don't want to calibrate it too specifically for CoC 7th. That'll likely be a common use case, but I tested it on older CoC material, and it's broadly written to be for any d100.
Hi Kumada - I understand better now…The broader approach adapts the toolkit to work with the widest spectrum of d100 games.
Thank you for being open to my comments and discussion.
Much appreciated!
Hello! Quick question on converting d100 NPC/monster percentage values: how does this work in play?
For example, if I have a night watchman with 65% Spot Hidden, this becomes 13 in Cthork Borg (1 DR per 5% skill rating). Subtracting 13 from 20 is DR7. So the night watchman has a Spot Hidden DR7...IF the night watchman NPC is the one doing the rolling.
However...
Since in Cthork Borg, the player-characters are typically doing the dice rolling most of the time, DR7 seems awfully low for them to elude the night watchman with Spot Hidden 65%. By the same logic, a night watchman with Spot Hidden 75% would have a DR5, and be even easier for the player-characters to elude, if we're subtracting the watchman's value from 20.
In other words, why subtract from 20? Why not just take the NPC or monster's percentage value and divide it by 5 to get the Cthork Borg DR value?
If the NPC or monster is making the roll, then yes, subtracting from 20 makes sense.
Thanks and best,
Brian C., avid Cthork Borg fan
Ah, okay. This might be a design problem with no perfect solution.
In Cthork, with player vs NPC rolls, you typically just have the player roll against standard difficulty (DR 12). You can also apply penalties or bonuses based on weather conditions, the skill of the opposition, etc.
Those 'subtract from 20' values are for if an NPC needs to use a skill on their own. For example, Spot Hidden on a dingy room, or Climb up a cliffside.
That said, calculating 1 DR for every 5% of the NPC's skill definitely also works, and your method gives a lot more nuance to opposed rolls. I think GMs could use either.
Basically, in your above example, the Night Watchman's Spot Hidden DR 7 isn't the difficulty for players to sneak past him. It's the difficulty for him to spot non-player things in his environment. If he does try to spot a player, the roll for the player to sneak past him is DR 12 + optional modifiers assigned by the GM.
I figured out a better way to phrase this and patched the document!
The current version, 5.15.22, should resolve the issue.
Wonderful! Thank you!
No problem!